Beau Peep Notice Board
Beau Peep Notice Board => Outpourings => Topic started by: Mince on September 06, 2007, 01:13:57 PM
-
This guy has been collecting the letters he is sent from Television Licensing and displaying them on his website, along with some funny comments. It's interesting reading:
http://www.bbctvlicence.com/2006%20letters.htm (http://www.bbctvlicence.com/2006%20letters.htm)
http://www.bbctvlicence.com/ (http://www.bbctvlicence.com/)
-
Why doesn't someone prosecute them for harassment?
-
You can send them a letter telling them not to harass you, and that stops the letters. You can also withdraw from their employees the implied consent to approach your door, and that stops the visits. It then becomes difficult for television licensing to gain any evidence that you are watching television without a licence, and so they cannot apply for a search warrant either. It's not illegal to ignore them completely. It's also not illegal to own a television without a licence if you only watch DVDs or play games. The television detector vans have never been used to prosecute anyone. (Television licensing rely on intimidation and on people thinking they have to confess to "enforcement officers".) And the workings and calibrations of the hand-held detectors have never been disclosed so they cannot be used as evidence in a court anyway.
-
You can send them a letter telling them not to harass you, and that stops the letters. You can also withdraw from their employees the implied consent to approach your door, and that stops the visits. It then becomes difficult for television licensing to gain any evidence that you are watching television without a licence, and so they cannot apply for a search warrant either. It's not illegal to ignore them completely. It's also not illegal to own a television without a licence if you only watch DVDs or play games. The television detector vans have never been used to prosecute anyone. (Television licensing rely on intimidation and on people thinking they have to confess to "enforcement officers".) And the workings and calibrations of the hand-held detectors have never been disclosed so they cannot be used as evidence in a court anyway.
There ought to be a website about this.
-
There is one:
http://www.tvlicensing.biz/ (http://www.tvlicensing.biz/)
There is also a forum:
http://www.tvlicensing.biz/phpBB2/ (http://www.tvlicensing.biz/phpBB2/)
-
Why don't you just pay the bloomin' thing? Wimbledon and Match Of The Day don't come cheap, you know.
-
Why don't you just pay the bloomin' thing? Wimbledon and Match Of The Day don't come cheap, you know.
They do when you don't buy a television licence.
Besides, it's less fun that way.
-
I was reading the bit about Johnathan Miller. He used to write about his campaign in the Sunday Times a few years ago. It all seems to have gone quiet after 2003...
I do pay my licence, Tarks, but I feel uncomfortable with the BBC's assumption of guilt if you haven't got a telly. Imagine if you stopped having a tv but they continued to threaten you and intimidate you.
-
They have been known to send letters even when you have a licence. Their salesmen (sorry, "Enforcement Officers") do not undergo criminal checks and yet they expect you to let them into your home. (You don't have to, of course.) Because most of their convictions come from confessions and because their salesmen are paid bonuses for convictions, they tend to prey on the single parents and the elderly, and tend to use underhand tactics, intimidation, and sometimes even criminal behaviour to get their bonuses.
-
(http://www.turnoffyourtv.com/international/bbc.havealifead.jpg)
-
Why don't you just pay the bloomin' thing? Wimbledon and Match Of The Day don't come cheap, you know.
But if you don't watch tv, why should you be intimidated into paying a licence?
I don't watch sport, soaps, quiz games, discussions or 'reality' tv. What's left is/are repeats that I watched the first time round - probably in the sixties - and, having seen them umpteen times, find the humour/novelty has worn thin.
I have loads of videos (it's amazing how cheap they are in charity shops; everyone is giving them away because they've moved over to DVDs!) that I watch when I'm in the mood and when I've run out of books.
I don't feel I should be browbeaten into paying for a licence when I am not watching what the tv companies are broadcasting. So there!
-
Do you have a TV aerial, Vulture? If so, is it plugged in?
-
Do you have a TV aerial, Vulture? If so, is it plugged in?
That's for her to know, and you to find out, Tarquin. Don't let power go to your head. ;)
-
Do you have a TV aerial, Vulture? If so, is it plugged in?
No, and No.
(Are you moonlighting?)
-
Do you have a TV aerial, Vulture? If so, is it plugged in?
These are rather serious questions do you work for the licensing office at the BBC TT111
-
Here is an example of how to annoy TV licensing salesmen.
All TVL officers have an ID card. They cannot knock your door without one. You have the right to see it and you have the right to close the door while you phone Bristol to check it.
TVL: Hello, I'm a TVLA Persecutions Officer. Here's my authority. [Shows you his card.]
Objector: Do you mind if I just check this? It's just that we've had a number of bogus callers in the area lately.
TVL: Certainly.
Objector shuts door.
Phone up Bristol TVL and give them the details on the card. Ask if this card is theirs. They say it is. Meanwhile you are writing the TVL address on the front of an envelope.
Pop the card in the envelope.
Leave the house and explain you are just going to the shop and will be back in two minutes. The TVL officer will almost certainly pursue you requesting his card and may possibly call for backup. However, he cannot lay a hand on you. He will simply obstruct or pursue.
Drop the envelope into the post box and return to your house and await the police. Alternatively, if you have a post office nearby you can go there and they will stamp it for you.
Now, enjoy the aftermath.
If the police do arrive, the TVL officer will claim that you have stolen his card. Calmly explain to the attending constable that he gave you the card and that you have simply returned the card to the confirmed owner - ie. TVL, Bristol. This does not constitute theft, for which the legal definition is "To take some item without consent with the intention of permanently depriving the owner thereof."
The police won't be happy about it (unless they see the humour of the situation) but there's nothing they can legally do about it.
(Caveat: The police don't care about the law and may arrest you anyway - no charges will be brought however, and you will be released.)
I have used this on a number of occasions and it's always worked like a dream. If they try to physically restrain you, simply point out that they are assaulting you - in a loud but polite manner, making sure that others notice your protest.
Better still is if you have a family member leave and post it for you whilst he stands at the door expecting your return. Then you can politely inform him that if they rush they might just catch it before it's posted. The look on their faces is just fantastic.
The great thing about this is that if they don't have a spare (and in my experience they never do), they have to quit for the day - in fact, until they get a new licence printed or the old one arrives. Always use second class post. Never use the postcode!
Always great fun.
-
Do you have a TV aerial, Vulture? If so, is it plugged in?
These are rather serious questions do you work for the licensing office at the BBC TT111
Do you have a TV aerial, Vulture? If so, is it plugged in?
No, and No.
(Are you moonlighting?)
No, I'm Zorro!
(sigh!)
-
No, I'm Zorro!
(sigh!)
But who do you work for Zorro
Note I don't care if you change your name they all do it in the loony Bin
-
No, I'm Zorro!
(sigh!)
But who do you work for Zorro
Note I don't care if you change your name they all do it in the loony Bin
Not easy to change that name. Zorro seems to be the hardest word.
-
No, I'm Zorro!
(sigh!)
But who do you work for Zorro
Note I don't care if you change your name they all do it in the loony Bin
Not easy to change that name. Zorro seems to be the hardest word.
Rozor! Whats difficult I use one every morning to shave.
-
How come Australia, with a population about a third of the UK, can afford to run their non-commercial TV station without all this licensing rigmarole? I'd forgotten about the UK television licence - what a ripoff! I think I'll stop whinging about the amount of ads on commercial TV as well.
-
Joan, we are treated to the cream of Australian TV over here, represented by such classics as Neighbours, Home & Away, Sons & Daughters, and Prisoner Cell Block H.
I think that probably answers your question.
-
Aha, so you pay dearly for being educated in the niceties of Australian life :P while we in return receive a wide selection of British fair for free, susidised by your licences no doubt - Dr Who, The Bill, Parkie, the odd Brit sitcom, to name but a few. We do have to pay to watch such gems as Eastenders and Coronation Street, though.
-
Joan, we are treated to the cream of Australian TV over here, represented by such classics as Neighbours, Home & Away, Sons & Daughters, and Prisoner Cell Block H.
I think that probably answers your question.
Tarks, you forgot Dame Edna.
-
I would like to announce that my cable company mailed me a Hallmark Card. I received it today.
Here it is:
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w64/SophieEmerald/CableCard.jpg)
Inside was the following message:
Thanks for your faith in us this past year
as we worked hard to bring you
the most up-to-date and reliable
home services in (*hidden to protect my whereabouts)
We know you have a choice of providers,
so your trust is quite an honor.
Your friends at Time Warner
P.S, We've included a token of appreciation.
Hope you enjoy it.
The token of appreciation was a fancy voucher: In appreciation for being a valued Time Warner Cable customer, we want to treat you to a fabulous theme park experience.
The voucher was for one free admission ticket to a popular amusement park and also allowed me to purchase additional tickets for half-price through December.
Hmmmmm.....I guess I have no complaints.
-
Hmm. I can't see the BBC doing something like this.
If you pay up, they ignore you: if you don't pay, you're inundated with threats.
I've been purchasing a TV licence every year since 1966 (I still have them all!), and the only time I heard from them was when I decided that enough was enough and I wasn't going to pay over ?100 for the privilege of having a TV that I didn't turn on!
-
I emailed the Licensing people from their website:
I'm seriously considering not having a TV anymore. However, I have been reading horror stories about people who no longer require a licence being hounded and treated like criminals, with the inference that they are breaking the law, when patently they are not. http://www.bbctvlicence.com/2006%20letters.htm
I hate the thought of this happening to me. Is there a way of making a clean break, so to speak, without this kind of harrassment?
Today I got a reply:
Dear Mr Sutherland
Thank you for contacting us.
As you will undoubtedly recognise, we have a duty to minimise television licence evasion and over the years we have found that one of the most effective and cheapest ways of doing this is to write to people reminding them of their obligation to purchase a licence where it is necessary for them so to do.
We have found from experience that people?s circumstances change, sometimes over short periods, and this is compounded by a high level of address changes arising from current movement of the population.
It is, therefore, the case that sometimes our letters are received by people, who have previously told us that they do not have a television set. I am sorry to say this is unavoidable.
When people tell us that they are not using a television set we annotate our records to that effect to ensure that a period elapses before we write to the same address because we realise how annoying it is to be constantly troubled in this way. Unfortunately we cannot grant permanent immunity for receiving our enquiries because of the constant change in circumstances I described earlier.
Yours sincerely
-
Sounds fair enough to me. We all suffer in many minor ways for the actions of law-breakers. It's them you should be condemning, not people who are trying to do a tough job.
-
Sounds fair enough to me. We all suffer in many minor ways for the actions of law-breakers. It's them you should be condemning, not people who are trying to do a tough job.
I agree, TT111. However, since notifying them that I no longer wish to avail myself of broadcast TV, I have been inundated with threatening letters. What do they constitute 'a reasonable period'? There is not a month goes by where I don't receive some sort of communication from them. I was away in Canada for a month this summer, and on my return there were five letters waiting for me.
-
I hardly ever get any snail mail any more.
Vulture, you are in the right. Just put them in the bin. If they send people to your door, smile and tell them, "not today thank you". If they turn up with the police, they're going to look pretty stupid, aren't they? If it were me, I'd probably even have a little fun with them.
Real harassment is when you wake up in central Baghdad to find your neighbour's house is missing, along with half of your own.
-
Sounds fair enough to me. We all suffer in many minor ways for the actions of law-breakers. It's them you should be condemning, not people who are trying to do a tough job.
I agree, TT111. However, since notifying them that I no longer wish to avail myself of broadcast TV, I have been inundated with threatening letters. What do they constitute 'a reasonable period'? There is not a month goes by where I don't receive some sort of communication from them. I was away in Canada for a month this summer, and on my return there were five letters waiting for me.
Yes, Vulture is right. It's not against the law to not have a TV, so you can't call people who don't have one, "law breakers". I watch TV and therefore have a TV licence, which is renewed automatically by direct debit.
If I got rid of the TV, and then got treated like a miscreant, even though I'd informed them of my decision, I'd be pretty annoyed, especially if it was persistent. Maybe the answer is that everyone should have a TV licence, regardless of whether they have a TV or not, because they have the ability to receive TV pictures should they choose.
-
I've been getting these letters on a regular basis for over 2 years now and I have a TV licence.
The problem arises from the way my address is shown - My licence shows my house number as 10d, but the threatening letters are addressed to 10 (1/2) which is the same flat.
In the early stages, I phoned, wrote and emailed to try to clear up the misunderstanding, all to no avail. They are a bunch of administrative tosspots.
My favourite bit is at the end of the letter when they say if you've recently bought a licence, to accept their apologies and ignore the letter.
I do. I will.
-
Real harassment is when you wake up in central Baghdad to find your neighbour's house is missing, along with half of your own.
I never have been happy with this argument. I agree that being harassed by Television Licensing is nothing compared to losing half your house. But redefining harassment as "not real" simply because someone elsewhere is suffering more harassment effectively renders everything as not harassment. For example, someone in Baghdad could turn to the guy who lost half his house and say "Real harassment is being made a Roman slave for your entire life, and then being crucified."
-
I've been getting these letters on a regular basis for over 2 years now and I have a TV licence.
Write to them to explain that the letters constitute harassment. That will stop them immediately.
-
Maybe the answer is that everyone should have a TV licence, regardless of whether they have a TV or not, because they have the ability to receive TV pictures should they choose.
The answer is to write a letter withdrawing from their employees and agents the usual implied access to your front door and to state that all visits and letters are harassment. That will stop everything for four years, after which you simply send the letter again. You do not need to explain whether you do or do not own a television, nor do you need to give them your name.
And it's not illegal to use a television for videos, dvds and games without a licence anyway. It's only illegal if you watch live broadcast television (whether the BBC or not). And the only way they can convict you of watching live television broadcasts without a licence is to get evidence against you; and since they cannot visit you, and you do not have to let them in anyway, and you have no intention of even communicating with them, gaining evidence is impossible. (They could use their mythic detector vans but no one has been convicted through evidence from such a van because - unlike speed cameras - the BBC refuse to give the courts details of how they work or how they are callibrated.)
-
The television licence costs ?135.50. You can rent 6 DVDs from Amazon for ?9.99. That means that the money used to pay for the licence could instead be used to rent 81 DVDs, all delivered to your door.
-
Real harassment is when you wake up in central Baghdad to find your neighbour's house is missing, along with half of your own.
I never have been happy with this argument. I agree that being harassed by Television Licensing is nothing compared to losing half your house. But redefining harassment as "not real" simply because someone elsewhere is suffering more harassment effectively renders everything as not harassment. For example, someone in Baghdad could turn to the guy who lost half his house and say "Real harassment is being made a Roman slave for your entire life, and then being crucified."
I've been getting these letters on a regular basis for over 2 years now and I have a TV licence.
Write to them to explain that the letters constitute harassment. That will stop them immediately.
Maybe the answer is that everyone should have a TV licence, regardless of whether they have a TV or not, because they have the ability to receive TV pictures should they choose.
The answer is to write a letter withdrawing from their employees and agents the usual implied access to your front door and to state that all visits and letters are harassment. That will stop everything for four years, after which you simply send the letter again. You do not need to explain whether you do or do not own a television, nor do you need to give them your name.
And it's not illegal to use a television for videos, dvds and games without a licence anyway. It's only illegal if you watch live broadcast television (whether the BBC or not). And the only way they can convict you of watching live television broadcasts without a licence is to get evidence against you; and since they cannot visit you, and you do not have to let them in anyway, and you have no intention of even communicating with them, gaining evidence is impossible. (They could use their mythic detector vans but no one has been convicted through evidence from such a van because - unlike speed cameras - the BBC refuse to give the courts details of how they work or how they are callibrated.)
The television licence costs ?135.50. You can rent 6 DVDs from Amazon for ?9.99. That means that the money used to pay for the licence could instead be used to rent 81 DVDs, all delivered to your door.
Good grief, Mince. What's in that tea that you keep drinking? I've got a lot to do today: can I have some?
-
I always pay for my licence and will continue to do so as long as required. After all, it's my BBC, God bless her.
-
I always pay for my licence and will continue to do so as long as required. After all, it's my BBC, God bless her.
That's the jolly spirit. Pip-pip! Carry on.
-
I like the BBC lots, and also pay my licence fee without hesitation. It's just that I think it's an archaic, serlish, tax.
-
I like the BBC lots, and also pay my licence fee without hesitation. It's just that I think it's an archaic, serlish, tax.
Serlish please explain what it means.
-
It's not too late-ish.
-
Peter, you may over-antilise my posts, but you get the general drift.
-
Tally O
-
Tally O
O?
-
Tally O
O?
P