Ebbsfleet?

[Roger Kettle]

I don't know about Diane but this is where we differ, Tarks. I don't think this was ever a "noble and worthy" cause. I think this was a blatant---albeit clever---scheme to raise money from the computer generation of football fans. I don't blame you or them for this. As I said, I think the whole thing was pretty clever but, let's face it, if you'd been asked 30 years ago to invest in an unknown English non-league side, what would your reply have been?

[Diane CBPFC]

I do honestly believe this was an innovation with very noble and worthy intentions, and that for many people disillusioned with the way the beautiful game has been hijacked as a fashionable corporate pastime at his highest levels, devaluing the loyal fan bases that put the big teams where they are, this was an understandable backlash by those desperate to reclaim the game in some form, for its working class roots.

It may prove to be ill-judged in time, who knows? Hindsight is always easy. But thousands of people saw something to get a little excited about when this started, and many of those remain faithful to the cause. I didn't have the time, nor the enthusiasm I actually yearned for. These days, I'm a long way from the football club I've actively supported man and boy, and was looking for something to replace that. Ironically, my old team have done that themselves, and are currently favourites to win their league, and the subject of many in-depth speculative emails between me and my kid brother (also in exile near Leeds), plus his Liverpool-supporting squash rival, whom he has persuaded to adopt St Johnstone as his second team, in light of Liverpool's determination to be this season's nearly men yet again. It's all been too fascinating for me to even begin to want to look over my shoulder at how Ebbsfleet are doing.

Wouldn't you agree, Diane?

Do they sell Penguin chocolate bars in your football club? That would make a big difference.

[The Peepmaster]

I don't know about Diane but this is where we differ, Tarks. I don't think this was ever a "noble and worthy" cause. I think this was a blatant---albeit clever---scheme to raise money from the computer generation of football fans. I don't blame you or them for this. As I said, I think the whole thing was pretty clever but, let's face it, if you'd been asked 30 years ago to invest in an unknown English non-league side, what would your reply have been?

At the time of investment, no-one knew what football club it was going to be, Roger. It could quite easily have been a league side, (there was a poll running as to who the fans favoured), and it wasn't until later that it was announced that Ebsfleet was to be the club.

They haven't been pulling up any trees this season, and that's also a reason why some "supporters" have become disillusioned, perhaps.

[Tarquin Thunderthighs lll]

It certainly was a blatant attempt to raise money, Roger, but they were completely up front about that. In fact, it was the main purpose of the exercise, but as far as I know, nobody has got rich out of this, and the scheme goes on. If it was a scam of any sort, it would have been blown wide open by now in the press, but however misguided it eventually proves to be, I don't see the cynicism in this that you do. I read everything carefully before parting with my initial shekels, and although there was never any guarantee of success (and certainly no promise of monetary reward for any investor - this was always about getting involved), I saw it as a genuine attempt by football-loving, non profit-seeking entrepreneurs (if that's not a paradox) to try something different, and bring the fans back into football beyond lining the pockets of the big money chairmen. 

[The Peepmaster]

Some had hoped it would have been a club with a higher profile, like Leeds United, that was adopted. Even a smaller club along the lines of Margate, Woking, Grays Athletic, Dundee Utd., or Bury, would have been acceptable.

I think there was some tangible disappointment when Ebsfleet was announced as being the club.

[Roger Kettle]

(Ignores Dundee United jibe)
That's what I mean, Peeps. It was a question of money first and we'll work out the details later. I've said all along that I thought it was a clever idea but they were selling a dream which, in my view, they had little chance of delivering.

[Tarquin Thunderthighs lll]

If anyone seriously thought the money that was targeted would ever be enough to buy a club of the stature and facilities of Leeds United, even in their current lowly position, they were out of their tiny minds. It was always going to either be a non-league club, or a league club in desperate financial straits where a million quid would make a real difference.

I actually think Ebbsfleet wasn't a bad choice in the end, sitting in the top half of a feeder league for the bigger leagues. Of course it would have been better had they been in the hunt for promotion straight away, but there is no automatic right to that, and although a good sum of money was raised, we're still a million miles away from the type of success-buying investment that the likes of Abramovich has brought to Chelsea for instance. Again, anyone who thought that success would automatically follow was not in touch with reality. That's certainly not the reason I've opted out - my own football-supporting history underlines that I have never been a glory-chaser.

I think it was more a case of me letting them down than the other way around in the end. I simply didn't find the time to visit the website or follow the club's progress and business. they certainly tried to keep up my interest with frequent reports and communications, and I don't think they can be faulted for effort.

There was always going to be a problem with the location of the club in the end, and possibly a more centrally-based club in England might have proven a more popular choice to give the backers a fairer chance of actually attending some games. Ironically, after my interest had waned, my nearest 'big' club, Wrexham FC, were relegated out of the 'big' leagues for the first time in their history, and found themselves in the same Blue Square league as Ebbsfleet - I missed my chance to see them by one day, as I drove past Wrexham's stadium on a Sunday, to see Ebbsfleet's name on the huge Next Game hoarding, about to be removed 24 hours after the game. I was almost gutted!

I really do hope the 'dream' continues though, Roger, and I certainly have no regrets about that initial investment. There's always been a sense of romance associated with football, which is a big part of why the die-hard fans go back week-in, week-out even in the bleak times (which for many clubs is more often than not). This venture was always a bit Roy of the Rovers, and that's what appealed to me initially. I don't feel like a sucker in any way, and I really doubt whether many of those who did as Peepsie and I did will feel that way either.





Apart from my better half of course...who didn't read the small print, hates football, and thought she was buying an actual share.

[Roger Kettle]

You make a sound case, Tarks, and I'm glad you enjoyed the experiment.

[Mince]

You make a sound case, Tarks, and I'm glad you enjoyed the experiment.

Don't give in, Roger! Write a longer post than he did. You can do it. I know you can.